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Arteine's Most Wanted - Dane Althenn, The Disgraced [Str-Dire]

Discussion in 'Hero Ideas' started by NuclearCookie, Jan 31, 2018.

  1. NuclearCookie

    NuclearCookie Member

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    The campfire sizzled, its slowly diminishing flame finally dying out. Looking around, Zal found his companions soundly asleep, resting for the long journey in the morning. He knew he had to catch some shut-eye as well. The trip from Bastion to the Tenera desert was a long and arduous one, even if they were going to go around bone elven lands. Yet the the same thought he had had for the past few days returned, clawing at the back of his mind. Tarek Aelos had escaped. Just the thought of his name sent shivers down Zal's spine. Why now, of all possible times? The world was already in a shit place - they had a godkilling crusade in full sway, war between the city states, the bone elven Gray March, and now an undying lunatic on the loose. A lunatic that had destroyed the Spine.

    Zal thought back to simpler times. As simple as a moof's life ever was - hunt things too dangerous to die, haul them off to The Spine, lock them up, repeat. It helped that Talon was with him and he didn't have to walk, too. Simpler times. Better times. Duller times.

    Until a week ago, when the raven arrived with the news. The Spine - ruined, its guardians - dead, the cells - open, Tarek - escaped. Along with the message came a scroll, one that Zal had quickly hidden from his companions. He knew that if they saw its contents, they'd wish to turn back and help. But getting Vaas to Bazshiig had to come first, lest he lost control of his transformation. The Remnant priests had experience with dying gods, they would surely be of help. No amount of escaped prisoners was a greater danger than Vaas.

    Yet Zal was still curious to read the scroll. He knew what it was, of course, without any doubt. A distress call from command, mobilising all moofs. A list of names that each moof had to track down and subdue, at any means necessary.

    Curiousity was always Zal's weakness. Without further waiting, he broke the seal. He took a quick glance at the contents and froze. Sweat dripped from his forehead onto the sheet, the hairs on his hands standing up, an overwhelming sense of dread not unlike the one that Tarek Aelos' presence instills gripped Zal's very being.

    "Shit."

    DANE ALTHENN - THE DISGRACED

    [​IMG]

    Melee - Carry - Durable - Escape

      • ]
    • Case File #17

      Prisoner Name: Dane Althenn

      Race: Human

      Nationality: Statesman - Vermillion

      Date of Capture: 11th of Thawing, 971 IC

      Capturer: Threnn the Lucid

      Cell Level: 7

      Renown: Recognised by the Imperial Militairy School, the Vermillion Academy of Sword Arts, the Nosk Warrior Leagues and the Order of the Frozen Sun as one of the ten greatest swordsmen currently alive, ranked 4th. Frontline experience in the War of Succession, the 944, 946 and 949 Ketryn Empire-Vermillion Monarchy border disputes on the side of the Monarchy. Highly decorated tactician and general. Pioneer of the sworddancing style of battle. Romanticised in the Tome of Ardents as "A warrior of grace and poise, creating art with the blade, from battle to battle, never stopping, never ending."

      Reason for Detainment: Disgraced former crusader. Fought against the demonic incursion led by Shemor, and was believed KIA at The Battle of Usfi. Later found, and returned to active duty. Secretly possessed by an emissary of the Demonic Host. At The Battle at the Gray Gates, massacred his entire platoon and the bone elf regiment present, while letting the incursion pass. Planted the Crusaders' Banner in the corpse of bone elven general Raiio, triggering the current Gray March. All attempts at exorcism failed. Detained with aurelium shackles and triple dampening wards.

      Status: Escaped

      Contract assigned to: Zal Teries of the Elden Haven
      • [​IMG]
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    Last edited: Jan 31, 2018
  2. ThunderTF2

    ThunderTF2 Member

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    Year 2017, still gettin those goose bumps meeting word "innate" in dota concept [​IMG]

    reading atm

    Innate

    Idk.

    Q

    Too strong?
    Actually it lacks info on ability, no cast thing info (upswing, backswing, animation etc etc)
    Farm alone its OP. Min 13 BF into min 20 bf + 2 slots (no joke)
    Fight - depends (cast thing are unclear). Initiation point > Q > hitty hit > Q > insta W =

    W

    "All of Dane's abilities generate Fatigue."
    I think you should rephrase this.
    Does it check fatigue while its active?

    Example:
    1) You have 70-75-80 Fatigue (q+q, q+w, w+w)
    2) W used
    3) "Silences for a short duration" passes (just like Pudge's Hook thing?, its called "Disable"
    4) You use E or Q, fatigue should be less that 100 AND W should have some time remaining
    5) Time passes
    6) Fatigues gone

    Or it check fatigues on cast?

    E

    Again no info on cast thing.
    Someone should play less OW.

    R

    Tiredness?
    I guess u meant it reduces duration of innate ability drawback from 6 to 5/4/3

    Mr Prophet predicted SOLD OUT storm:
    [​IMG]

    Its not like ability is bad, depends on how W works.
    If it works like in a example - Its OP.
    Yet again, its hard to judge without seeing cast animation nubmers.

    Talents

    10 - dont care
    15, 20 - I dont hate talant system improvement, but i think yours are way too good.
    25 1 talent - dont care
    25 2 talent - 50%+ free global (increases all damage, atleast its what you wrote) bonus dmg?

    Aghanims

    Thats not fair, dude.
    You can't eat your cake and have it (too).
    Well, you can have it, but in your belly.

    Overall, some abilities and stuff i like, but as a whole its OP concept
    I never (i guess \ i hope) played dota imba, but i guess even them does not have such montrosity of a hero.
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2018
  3. NuclearCookie

    NuclearCookie Member

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    Actually, I've been playing torclight 2, and it had a hero with the Fatigue concept which I loved.

    About cast/backswing - call me old fashioned, but I still believe that unless explicitly needed, all of the hero's abilities should use the default cast point/backswing thats in the advanced statistics tab. The only statistic that mattered here was turn rate, as two abilities are dependant on hero orientation.

    It does say that he is silenced during Respite, so theres no way to gain fatigue during it.

    I do have a thing against the talent system in DotA though, and do think it would be better if it was like HotS' one - less passive crap, more ability and gameplay choices and changes. Maybe I should nerf level 25 one, but it does still require 3 seconds of self silence.

    Changed Fury to instead generate fatigue on auto attacks, but drain it constantly over time, as having infinite fatigue was too OP.
     
  4. ThunderTF2

    ThunderTF2 Member

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    Maybe its wrong to suggest it, cuz im not even yet look over it
    Try to compare HotS ports from OW, it might help you.
    I dont feel this concept ever meeting dota reqs.
    LoL has (had?) some heroes without manapool (but with another resource to use\activate or boost abilities they use)
    Your concept use both mana and fatigue, thats really... wrong? hard to find balance?
     
  5. NuclearCookie

    NuclearCookie Member

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    dont think so. just making the hero with low cds and reasonably low manacosts balances out well with the fatigue concept. its also the reason his spells are stronger than average.
     
  6. summer-penguin

    summer-penguin Moderator Staff Member

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    I would personally enjoy more a hero with low cds and reasonably low manacosts balanced, yes, but w/out the innate.
    Or at least have Fatigue working math-free. Simpler. Easier to predict and plan accordingly.
    Something like this:
    Every time Dane uses an ability he stacks a point of Fatigue. 6 points of Fatigue and Dane wears out, getting his attackspeed and movespeed reduced by 50/50%, and getting silenced.
    This exhaustion and any Fatigue points last 6 seconds.

    I like the way Respite is supposed to interact with his innate reversevely. That was neat.

    Great art/icons composition btw.
    :santa:

    My 5 cents.
     
    Jon likes this.
  7. NuclearCookie

    NuclearCookie Member

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    Its not that much math though. Fixed costs and all. Plus allows me better fine tuning than X costs 2 fatigue, Y costs 1. Cap 6. With 3 skills to balance against it, I'd rather not make them all the same cost. As for the other balancing, I'm almost positive that my sense of balance hasnt left me yet.
     
  8. NuclearCookie

    NuclearCookie Member

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    And the Icons are all thanks to you, summer. That thread is bae.
     
  9. dewouter

    dewouter Moderator Staff Member

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    Stats look ok, nothing special. Pretty tanky hard hitter.

    The innate is a bit weird, but interesting

    Sword Arc is simple yet fun ability. Will be great at mashing through waves, might be a bit too good at clearing creep camps, but then again so is Sven and the mana cost is no joke. Cast point greatly matters here.

    Respite makes this hero feel a lot like huskars heal, might be a great spell for him too. The cooldown part is only when the buff is active? Also the cast point is really important here too, it would be nice to use this without stopping for (too long)

    Cross Counter might be too good against slow ranged projectiles and I must say I don't like the idea of reflecting attacks. But I do love spiked carapece. The low cooldown might be annoying to play against.

    Dashing through cliffs on such a low cooldown makes a hero almost uncatchable, the manacost might make it acceptable, but I doubt it.

    The idea is pretty nice, but it might have few too many low cooldown spells.
     
  10. NuclearCookie

    NuclearCookie Member

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    THERE'S A CAST POINT IN THE ADVANCED STATS TAB FFS
     
  11. dewouter

    dewouter Moderator Staff Member

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    Didn't expand it because I didn't expect it to be there.
     
  12. NuclearCookie

    NuclearCookie Member

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    ITS ALWAYS THERE HOW DO PEOPLE READ JUST THE PARTS WITH ICONS SMH FML
     
    Skulls_n_Souls likes this.
  13. Skulls_n_Souls

    Skulls_n_Souls Member

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    Kinda reminded me of Master Yi
    My review will be a bit chaotic, as I will not do this ability-by-ability.

    I actually expected his skills to be a tad more powerful than this with that innate. It's true that he has pretty low cooldowns, but still his abilities are very limited due to his fatigue thing. It's like "I have very low cd's but I still have to wait 6 seconds to cast another ability. So yay on my low cd's."
    I suggest you increase all cd's (by 1 second tops) and reduce manacost/increase damage from your abilities. Or just boost his statistics.

    Respite: I think Althen should be able to cancel the silence effect anytime in its duration. Darining ALL fatigue sounds a bit over the edge. Here are my proposed changes:
    1. Respite heals based on your current fatigue points at the moment of cast instead of those that are drained.
    2. Respite drains a steady amount per second instead of ALL your fatigue points in its duration.
    3. Can be canceled by casting again or clicking the buff icon.

    All of your talents except level 25 right talent feel underwhelming and can be boosted. In addition, I suggest you replace one of the talents with +armor reduction from Cross Counter or make it decrease enemies' armor by 50% of yours.

    btw I can't see cast animation anywhere including advanced statistics :cat:
     
  14. Lu Sven-Oden Bartsson

    Lu Sven-Oden Bartsson New Member

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    Background story: A bit generic, but it fits Dota universe so why not. Not many read background stories and lore nowadays anyway. I feel like it needs a bit more connection to heroes and locations from dota lore, but it is fine as it is anyway.

    The looks: I see just by looks and background story a lot of similarities with Sven, it lacks originality in my opinion. However, it is well drawn, I can imagine him being put in game - however, I fear he would easilly get confused for Sven.

    For the abilities:

    Fatigue: it has quite unique mechanic. I think it is quite okay, but I think it should give some bonuses too rather than nerfs. I would suggest that the higher the fatigue, maybe the higher hp reg or maybe spell amp, up to 100% at 100, which would not really benefit him much but item procs would deal more dmg? (dagon for lols?)

    Sword Arc: I would suggest lower dmg or higher cd or maybe making cd lower per skill point, like 5/4/3/2.75? That would make it a bit less OP in early game at least. Also I would reccomend it to reduce by half, or 0.75 the value of cleave if got any. That would stop BF from becoming too OP in team fights... Such mechanics as with ember spirit for whom every creep reduces the dmg, which also lowers the potential of bf, otherwise it would be too OP.

    Respite: I would suggest make the cooldown reduce not 1s/each hit or sword arc as guaranteed, but chance-based, such as 65% chance or so. Otherwise it seems fine.

    Cross counter: legion commander's passive, just without lifesteal but 100% dmg block basically? It seems fine, but I would like to know how that works with disarm/hex. would you still be able to counter if you are hexed or disarmed, stunned or disabled?

    Blade dash: I assume it is his ult? I do not like the cooldown at all, I would suggest either giving it charges with bigger cooldown, say 2/3/4 charges, and 30 cd per each charge. Either that or raise that cooldown to let's say 15/13/11 seconds.
    Together with rest of his skills and potential farm his ult can really be gamebreaking at the rate it is right now.

    Another thing that concerns me:
    1. How would his Fatigue be affected by octarine core/kaya? Would the kaya also reduce fatigue? Would octarine reduce cooldown?
    2. As he is a str hero, the silence from his fatigue will be reduced by the ammount of str he has. did you put this into account?
    3. With his fatigue system, it feels unnececary for him to even have a mana pool and mana cost. I would suggest him having 0 mana pool, 0 int, and +0 int per lvl and remove mana cost.

    As for skill tree:
    int or health at lvl 10? I would suggest no int at all, and maybe give spell amp instead. As for health... 90...? I never saw any hero with 90 hp as talent and it seems just so unnecessary. I would raise it at minimum up to 180/250.
    The rest seems fine.

    As for aghanim, I like the concept, but I think it should be passive, not give it as ability, and rework it with the fatigue. Maybe make it a 15 sec duration skill with 60 cd that activates automatically when fatigue reaches 100, and you still get silenced for the first few seconds of the fury? It could be paired well with MoM.

    In general: I think this concept is a bit messy in a way, lacks originality in terms of hero lore and looks, but the skills have potential, could be even well ballanced and fit in the Dota2 meta perfectly. I just dislike the general similarity with Sven in general, and the fatigue system could make or break the game. It seems very complicated at first, but after giving it some time to read and understand I would say this has a potential.